mandolin and fiddle destroyed

[billkilpatrick]

the 81 year old, very religious father of a friend of mine on facebook destroyed his family's fiddle and mandolin because he thought they were symptoms of a wasted life and were in someway connected to satan. i don't imagine anyone here would find sympathy with the old guy so there's no need to comment on what he did - but does anyone know who, what, why, where, etc. this incredible idea comes from?

[almeriastrings]

Good overview of the violin mythology here:

http://www.rachelbartonpine.com/mus/mus_07_notes.htm

Also:

"As in many European countries, the fiddle was a target for disapproval by certain branches of the church. This was particularly so as so many pagan and devil-related myths were attached to Norwegian fiddling. In the early to mid 1800's a religious movement called The Pietists, lead by Hans Nielsen Hauge, spread through rural districts of Norway. The Hardanger fiddle- "the devil's instrument", was highlighted as a source of sinful activity related, as ever, to drinking and fornication (yes, all the good things in life!), and fiddlers were driven to stop playing and often to destroy their instruments"

Source: http://www.fiddlingaround.co.uk/scandinavia/index.html

Not heard of it in connection with the mandolin, but hey.... close enough I suppose!

[John Kelly]

Goes away back into the mists of history, Bill. Probably originally derives from the idea that pleasurable activities are somehow tools of the devil designed to trap us into becoming followers.
The Free Church in Scotland, especially in the Western Isles, has its worship led by a precentor who leads the singing of the psalms; there is no musical instrument used to back the singing, yet other churches have provided some of the finest music in our cultures. Maybe a throwback to the days of extreme Presbyterianism and the shadow of the reformer John Knox who was a leading figure in promoting the Protestant culture which we Scots still seem to have hanging over us as an obstacle to things pleasurable.
Remember the lines in Burns' wonderful poem "Tam O'Shanter" when Tam sees the coven of witches dancing in the old kirkyard of Alloway, with Satan (Auld Nick) accompanying them on the bagpipes.
Isn't it the Salvation Army who say, about the rousing music they play in their brass and silver bands "Why should the Devil have all the best tunes"?

[swampstomper]

That was Martin Luther who first stole tunes from the devil. "A Mighty Fortress" (Ein feste Burg ist unser Gott) was a rowdy drinking song until he put some righteous lyrics to it.

And destroying "trifles of this world" has a long history -- rememer Savonarola who organize the famous "bonfire of the vanities" in Florence (Firenze), February 1497, when he convinced the ladies to burn their finery and the scholars to burn "pagan" books (i.e., the classics). Of course he only lasted one more year before getting his own bonfire. "Romola" by George Eliot is a great description of this period.

[mandocrucian]

Fiddle BAD! - - - - - - - Hedge fund......GOOD!

[billkilpatrick]

didn't know if it was an auld or new world thing - my friend lives in shetland, which would explain it ... (ach, aye!) he said his hand was shaking as he was typing to let us know what had happened. fiddle was inherited from his grandfather - his father bought the mandolin when he was a young man.

the taliban have a diabolic view of music but is there a passage in the bible to suggests this? i know that "fun" is universally suspect in certain sects but is there a specific reference they draw on? ... are church bells considered music?

very curious ...

[catmandu2]

...the bible

Old, or new?

[Bigtuna]

the 81 year old, very religious father of a friend of mine on facebook destroyed his family's fiddle and mandolin because he thought they were symptoms of a wasted life and were in someway connected to satan. i don't imagine anyone here would find sympathy with the old guy so there's no need to comment on what he did - but does anyone know who, what, why, where, etc. this incredible idea comes from?

That's very sad. Two pieces of family history now gone. What's interesting to me is that it took him 50+ years to reach this epiphany.

[Darren Bailey]

Without wishing to upset anyone could readers of this thread hold clear in their minds the distinction between modern protestant ideas that have produced this puritan nonsense and traditional Christianity which teaches no such thing. I have been to many Greek evenings where the priest has been as much fun as anyone else.

[Pete Jenner]

Thank God for us pagans!

[Ed Goist]

I would guess that the religious-based reason used here is really just an excuse for what is actually an extreme case of old person "get off my lawn" bitterness being directed toward the world in general.

[Schlegel]

You do see this crop up from time to time but I don't think there's any textual support for it. It's a symptom, I think of a recurring ascetic impulse that manifests in many times and cultures.

[Ron McMillan]

Whatever the motivation or rationale, it's a sad sad story.

ron

[Caleb]

There's a scene just like this is George MacDonald's (Scottish Victorian-era writer) book ROBERT FALCONER. Robert's grandmother burns his fiddle for what she views as its negative influence on the boy. It's a heartbreaking scene.

MacDonald is one of my favorite writers. While I don't think he was a musician, he was a great lover of the arts, and I always find his descriptions of music fascinating. I do know some of his children played various instruments and that he enjoyed their playing.

[shortymack]

Bill, theres many verses in the Bible that support and encourage music, mostly in Psalms. Music is indeed a gift and has no Biblical ties to anything evil.

[hank]

Unfortunately all things scientifically unprovable and completely illogical including the red guy with horns and halo wearing winged harp artists is pretty fertile ground for mental illness to manifest.

[Jim]

Bill, sorry for your friends loss. There must be alot of deep down pain in a person who feels the need to destroy a thing of beauty. (Two things in this case). They are crying out for attention in a very inappropriate way. It's a shame religion is used as an excuse for such behavior though it often is.

[shortymack]

Unfortunately all things scientifically unprovable and completely illogical including the red guy with horns and halo wearing winged harp artists is pretty fertile ground for mental illness to manifest.

So are you saying that those who believe in God are mentally ill because man has no scientific proof? Thats a broad insulting brush you are working with.

[Patrick Hull]

Wouldn't the obvious conclusion be that the old fellow is just off his rocker, and any attempt to analyze his thought process is simply a waste of time?

[Russell26]

I agree with Patrick Hull the dudes lost it.I'm a christian and I have been playing fiddle my whole life I even play in my church so as Patrick says sounds like the old guy is off his rocker.Oh and Hank what you said is very insulting I would be carefull what you say alot of bluegrass music is filled with gospel tunes so alot of mandolin players are christians.

[delsbrother]

Some things are just too weird to understand. Like this video.

[Austin Bob]

So sad to hear of that. It's easy to jump to conclusions without knowing the details, but sometimes dementia can produce extreme behavior like that.

[hank]

Shorty and Russell I'm sorry you read that into my meaning it wasn't my intention.

[Dagger Gordon]

I'm sad to hear this story, and even more so that it took place in this day and age in part of Scotland.

I'm sure most of you are aware that there is now a very strong fiddle tradition in the Shetland Isles, and some first rate mandolin players such as Gary Petersen. Shetland's music is a very important feature of life in the islands.

One possible 'explanation'' (and believe me, I've got no sympathy with this view myself) is a possible association of fairly heavy drinking with music.

[catmandu2]

Without being able to cite any historical wrutings on the subject--broadly, it's about "puritanism" and the age-old pitting of the sacred vs the profane--extant across many cultures. Specifically regarding the fiddle--it has ao g history being perceived as a rural, secular, primitive, philistine, etc instrument that accompanied DANCE -- the real evil in all of this

So, yes Bill--church bells were among the official ecumenical "instruments"--as well as any others carrying the liturgical music...(but not fiddle)