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Thread: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or new)

  1. #1
    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or new)

    Hey there,

    I've begun my search for a new (or vintage) mandolin. I'm in the market for an a-style, looking to spend about $500-$1000. I dont NEED to buy new, in fact i'd rather by used/vintage for my budget. In particular, I like the sound of very woody a-styles, as opposed to bright sounding a-styles. I hear only good things about Big Muddys, but have never played one. Every so often I see a 1920s Gibson A-jr that is just under $1000, although i've never actually played a junior. How do they sound? Deep/woody or bright? Also, is there anything else you may recommend to me?

    cheers!
    "That rug really tied the room together"

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    Gone Fishing Tiderider's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    I think you would be happy with a Kentucky KM900. I see these in your price range quite often.

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    Registered User sgrexa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Gibson A9 or F9, very good sounding and very consistent. THey also hold their value very well. If u can get an F9 under 2K you may find that it is as A LOT of mandolin for the money. Lately, I suggest to people with a 3-4K budget looking for a custom builder to look for an A9 and put the savings towards a deposit on a custom builder that they have researched, hopefully tried and then can work to make sure they get all the important aspects incorporated. When it is close to done, sell the F9 and pay off the custom build. This works for me anyway. Best of luck!

    Sean

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    Registered User almeriastrings's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    The Silverangel A models would also fit my definition of 'deep and woody'. You can sometimes find them used for around the top end of your budget.

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    Loarcutus of MandoBorg DataNick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Used: Flatiron Performer or Artist A model; my friend just sold his on the classifieds for about $1200...
    New: JBovier A5 Special, at $800 a great deal...

    Just my 2 cents!
    1994 Gibson F5L - Weber signed


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    Work in Progress Ed Goist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Flatiron Cadet $450 in the Cafe classifieds.
    This looks like a very good candidate, and it's in Canada, eh! (no financial interest on my part)
    (BTW, I wonder if this is the first time EVER that someone is recommending a mandolin priced below an OP's budget range?)
    c.1965 Harmony Monterey H410 Mandolin
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    I will suggest that one of the best buys for quality sound at a reasonable used price is the vintage Strad-O-Lin. These were made in the 1930s through the 1950s. They will run from roughly $250 to $350 approx. depending on cosmetic condition. There are normally 3 to 5 for sale on eBay at any given time, in various condition.... They were made of solid woods. (a few were made with plywood tops and backs, but the majority were solid). If you are interested, check out the Strad-O-Lin social group on this site... Lots of photos.

    I have eleven mandos but my two Strad-O-Lins get 90 percent of my playing time.

    I learned on a Big Muddy (Mid-Misouri) and yes, it is a very nice mandolin which gets quite high recommendations from owners.
    Last edited by bmac; Aug-10-2013 at 7:29am. Reason: speling
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  14. #8
    My Florida is scooped pheffernan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    In particular, I like the sound of very woody a-styles, as opposed to bright sounding a-styles. I hear only good things about Big Muddys, but have never played one. Every so often I see a 1920s Gibson A-jr that is just under $1000, although i've never actually played a junior. How do they sound? Deep/woody or bright? Also, is there anything else you may recommend to me?
    Could you describe the style of music that you intend to play on this mandolin? I must confess that when I was reading your post, I was already formulating a response in my head, so when I saw terms like "deep" and "woody," I expected you to add "dry" as code words that you were in the market for an instrument with f holes for playing bluegrass. In your price range, I immediately thought of the Kentucky KM900 that Tiderider suggested and the Gibson A9 that sgrexa recommended (and I think that alternatives offered by almeriastrings and DataNick are excellent if they fit your budget). Thus, I was taken aback a bit when the two mandolins that you mentioned were instruments with oval holes and the first one was a flattop. Big Muddy makes a fine mandolin -- I have a Mid-Missouri -- but there is something contradictory to my mind about looking for depth from an instrument which describes itself as flat. Now, Mike Dulak does give you lots of choice when it comes to tonewoods, and I've heard especially good things about the woody sound of his all-Mahogany M11, but I'd be dubious about its depth due to the inherent nature of its construction. A Gibson A -- I have one of those too -- does offer a deeper tone because of its carved design, and the ones from the 1920's are reputedly the best or at least most consistent. Some even suggest that they sound more like an instrument with f holes than their precursors, so perhaps there's your answer. Let me ask you another question: are you looking for this purchase to complement or replace the LM-600? I've been approaching your post with the latter in mind, in which case there is something paradoxical about a mandolinist who plays an instrument with f holes and prefers a dark and woody tone inquiring about alternatives with oval holes. If your intent is to replace The Loar, then I'd suggest that you stick with f holes and look for the Kentucky KM-900 or Gibson A9. However, should your goal be to add to your stable and broaden your tonal palette, then a Mid-Missouri / Big Muddy M11 might offer the woody character you seek, but for depth, I'd recommend a carved instrument like an old Gibson A.

    Good luck!
    Patrick
    Last edited by pheffernan; Aug-10-2013 at 9:40am.
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  16. #9
    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Thanks everyone for your input. Well, I haven't been playing mandolin for very long, so I haven't had a chance to try many types of mandos. I do want a mandolin with depth and I imagine an old gibby would have that. I think I could find a gibson ajr that is in my price range. Do you think that has the sound I'm looking for? I definitely want an a style, I do not want to replace the Loar. That being said, I don't want an a style that's very bright or tinny. I want it to sound like it has some character, and sort of a rough and deep "hollow" sound to it. I visualize a vintage instrument when I think of how I want this to sound. I imagine a mandolin thats aethetically seen better days, but has a big mouth on it. Forgive me if I am not making much sense it may only make sense in my head!!

    Am I on the right track? What are my options?
    "That rug really tied the room together"

    1919 Gibson A2
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    Norman B50 guitar

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    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Realize that generalizations about how all instruments of a certain make and model sound, are full of exceptions and special cases. You may find a Gibson A-Junior that meets your sound preferences, and another one that doesn't.

    Some obvious qualities in the $500-$1K range you've specified: all solid woods, hand-carved or hand-shaped top, A-model because that's what you've specified. If you're looking for a deeper sound, I'd advise trying a bunch of oval-hole instruments, since they tend to have a less sharp attack and a longer decay of the sound. Not exactly the "woody" vs. "tinny" dichotomy you've set up, but the sharp edge of an f-hole mandolin's attack may be construed as less "warm" than the somewhat more gradual attack of many oval-holes.

    As always, my semi-helpful advice is to play as many instruments in your price range as you can get your hands on, and let this experience guide you in your pursuit. Now, how many mandolins can you access in Hamilton? Could you visit a place like the Twelfth Fret in Toronto and try out what they have in stock?

    Remember that each mandolin is an individual instrument, and that while you can use general rules to whittle down your universe of choices (Can one whittle the universe? Quite the metaphysical question!), in the end you're choosing a single mandolin, not all the Gibson A-9's or Redline Travelers.

    Good luck.
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    Registered User eastman_315's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    . . . I don't want an a style that's very bright or tinny. I want it to sound like it has some character, and sort of a rough and deep "hollow" sound to it.
    Sounds a bit like what I was "visualizing" when I got my Breedlove KO. I personally like the K body style but they make an O-style (basically an A-style) as well. I agree with phefferman that you might want to start by checking out oval-hole mandos for the sound you're interested in.

    Take care,

    Frank

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  21. #12
    My Florida is scooped pheffernan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    Thanks everyone for your input. Well, I haven't been playing mandolin for very long, so I haven't had a chance to try many types of mandos. I do want a mandolin with depth and I imagine an old gibby would have that. I think I could find a gibson ajr that is in my price range. Do you think that has the sound I'm looking for? I definitely want an a style, I do not want to replace the Loar. That being said, I don't want an a style that's very bright or tinny. I want it to sound like it has some character, and sort of a rough and deep "hollow" sound to it. I visualize a vintage instrument when I think of how I want this to sound. I imagine a mandolin thats aethetically seen better days, but has a big mouth on it. Forgive me if I am not making much sense it may only make sense in my head!! Am I on the right track? What are my options?
    To complement The Loar with f holes that you have, rather than replace it, a mandolin with an oval hole makes sense. The Big Muddy M11 certainly has character, and they are out there. A new one is still listed at Acoustic Corner for $755: http://www.acoustic-corner.com/inventory.php. And I found a used one on CraigsList for $375 in Anchorage if you could work out the shipping: http://anchorage.craigslist.org/msg/3975205838.html. As a point of reference, my Redline Traveler shipped from Alaska to Florida for roughly $50. However, if you want vintage depth within your budget, a Gibson A might be your best best. There's an A Jr that seems to have had its work done already sitting at $600 with zero bids and twelve hours to go in the auction: http://www.ebay.com/itm/300944741396#shId. Or if you want the mystique, there's a Loar era A Jr. (without case) just one serial number after a signed March 16, 1923 F5 available for a Buy It Now price of $999: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-Gib...741396%26#shId. You have to wonder how much this one would command if it had a snakehead, as there's an A Jr. from arguably a less desirable year (1925) with no case, a replacement bridge, and a refinish for $1350: http://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/68265. So, on the current market and within your budget, you could conceivably buy both the CraigsList M11 and the 1921 Gibson A Jr. so as to try more mandolins, or you could centralize all of your buying power into one Loar-era 1924 (1923) Gibson A Jr. and hear what all the fuss is about (or not).

    Good luck!
    Patrick
    Last edited by pheffernan; Aug-11-2013 at 10:19am.
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    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Patrick, thanks so much for that info. Those gibsons look just right for me, but I am very cautious about buying online before I try it out. Like people have said, every vintage sounds different, even same year and model. I am not in a rush to buy... So should I wait for something to fall in my lap?

    Thanks a bunch!
    "That rug really tied the room together"

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    Registered User Eric F.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    You live near Folkways Music, which carries a good selection of mandolins. Why don't you go play everything they have and see what strikes you as deep and woody?

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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric F. View Post
    You live near Folkways Music, which carries a good selection of mandolins. Why don't you go play everything they have and see what strikes you as deep and woody?
    Good idea. I don't even know what you mean by deep and woody.

  27. #16

    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Bunting View Post
    Good idea. I don't even know what you mean by deep and woody.
    You don't?! I always assumed "deep" and "woody" were how one would describe Canada.

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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by vegas View Post
    You don't?! I always assumed "deep" and "woody" were how one would describe Canada.
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  31. #18
    My Florida is scooped pheffernan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    Those gibsons look just right for me, but I am very cautious about buying online before I try it out. Like people have said, every vintage sounds different, even same year and model. I am not in a rush to buy... So should I wait for something to fall in my lap?
    The closest mandolins I've purchased were in Ocala and Jacksonville, roughly four to five hours away. The farthest were in Alaska and New Zealand, which would constitute many days' journey. I've not yet found one in my lap.
    1924 Gibson A Snakehead
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Bunting View Post
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    It has been WAY too long since I visited your fishing paradise. I have not partaken of the divine joy which comes from catching lake trout, small mouth bass and walleye for way too many years. I think I need to plan a trip soon before my red cell count drops and my white cell count increases to frightful levels.

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  35. #20
    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by pheffernan View Post
    The closest mandolins I've purchased were in Ocala and Jacksonville, roughly four to five hours away. The farthest were in Alaska and New Zealand, which would constitute many days' journey. I've not yet found one in my lap.
    I think I am just hoping that the perfect gibson comes up for sale in driving distance from me, so I can try before I buy. Last week there was an a jr about 2.5 hours from me for $850, but she sold too quickly! I think I'll just wait my turn instead of getting one shipped.
    "That rug really tied the room together"

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  36. #21
    Registered User pefjr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    You are on the right track with the teen Gibson A models. A jr just sold on ebay for 661.00. I see them all the time at about 1,000.00. The best buy in town for deep and woody. Get the pre truss rod model A.
    I have the world in a jug, and the stopper in my hand.

  37. #22
    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by pefjr View Post
    You are on the right track with the teen Gibson A models. A jr just sold on ebay for 661.00. I see them all the time at about 1,000.00. The best buy in town for deep and woody. Get the pre truss rod model A.
    pefjr,

    I was watching that auction and I was surprised it sold for 661.00. Why pre truss rod models? What difference can I expect between a 1918 gibson jr and a 1928 gibson jr?
    "That rug really tied the room together"

    1919 Gibson A2
    The Loar 600
    Norman B50 guitar

  38. #23
    Jake L the_polish_mandolinist's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Just found this in the local classifieds.

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    the add states early 1930s, great condition, original condition, $275 obo

    What do you all think? I know its not a gibby, but seems good for its price.
    "That rug really tied the room together"

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  39. #24
    Registered User pefjr's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    pefjr,

    I was watching that auction and I was surprised it sold for 661.00. Why pre truss rod models? What difference can I expect between a 1918 gibson jr and a 1928 gibson jr?
    IMO, the TR gives a mandolin, a heavier neck and a metallic twang sound that takes away from the 'woody'. After the 1920 or so have TRs. As I said that is my opinion, certainly many in here disagree. Plug in any mandolin you want into utube and listen to the sound differences. Those A9s and F9s do come close .
    I have the world in a jug, and the stopper in my hand.

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  41. #25
    Mando accumulator allenhopkins's Avatar
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    Default Re: Looking for a deep woody sounding A-style mandolin. (Vint or

    Quote Originally Posted by the_polish_mandolinist View Post
    ...but seems good for its price.
    For $275 I'd jump on it, if the seller's honest about the condition. Just make sure that it's one of the US-made ones, and not one of the later Asian imports. The ends of the f-holes are comma-shaped, not round, so I don't know… Perhaps someone (Mike E?) from the Strad-O-Lin social group would have more expertise.

    Check this current thread for a discussion of the recent price increase for Strad-O-Lins.

    I have a much less impressive one, both in terms of quality and of condition, and it's a far better instrument than its humble beginnings would indicate.
    Allen Hopkins
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